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Finding a dentist
2003-08-12 20:30:09
Thanks A.K.
**** CARMARTHEN JOURNAL A Nagging Pain in Britain: How to Find a Dentist By LIZETTE ALVAREZ ARMARTHEN, Wales, Aug. 7 ? Nelson Kernahan, a dentist in this small Welsh-speaking town, was in his car still rubbing the sleep out of his eyes, easing himself out of his two-week vacation, when he spotted a line so long he could not pinpoint the end. "I said this couldn't be for us ? no, this couldn't be for us," said Dr. Kernahan, a 25-year-old from Belfast. "And it was. It was like a bread line." Advertisement On a rainy Monday morning two weeks ago, 600 people turned up outside Brynteg Dental Surgery, a tiny white-stucco office, to secure one of the 300 advertised appointments to see a National Health Service dentist. Wales is so lacking in government-subsidized dental treatment that some people pitched tents overnight rather than miss a chance for a slot. Others hopped buses from 90 miles away, only to arrive too late. A few even tried to bribe their way onto the list. "I just assumed they were giving away mobile phones," said Steve Acworth, who rode a bus for 75 minutes to reach Carmarthen. "The first person I talked to I thought was joking. Then I realized that it was absolutely serious." Not anticipating the dental mob, Mr. Acworth, 56, arrived too late, which he said was too bad, considering he does not really have any teeth to speak of. "My crowns all fell off," he said. "I got some really bad dentistry and it ruined all my root work. I have no front teeth and one pair of molars, which meet on the right side of my mouth. I can't bite anything." Ever fewer British dentists are willing to endure the grueling, assembly-line work required to take part in the National Health Service. On average, National Health Service dentists see 30 to 40 patients a day, compared with the 12 a day that dentists see in the United States. The dentists here are paid an amount set by the Health Service for each job they perform ? a filling, a root canal. They make considerably less money than private dentists, but also leave themselves open to criticism that they do unnecessary work to line their pockets. People who seek private care must pay for it, unless they have health insurance that covers it. Last year the Audit Commission warned that 4 of 10 dentists in England and Wales would not accept Health Service patients, and called for structural changes to the system. Dentists now earn half their income through private practice, by some analysts' estimates, more than a 40 percent increase from the numbers 10 years ago. "If you could earn more money for seeing less patients, what would you do?" asked Mr. Kernahan, who said he saw an average of 50 patients a day. "It's hard work. You are pushing it all the time." The situation in Carmarthen, a rural, misty outpost where the sing-song cadence of Welsh is heard as often as English, typifies a trend that is plaguing increasingly large parts of Britain, particularly in out-of-the-way places. There are fewer dental schools in Britain than there once were, and fewer dentists are being trained. Cardiff, Wales's capital, trains only 60 a year. To make matters worse, a high percentage of dentists are nearing retirement age or have already retired. Wales has 1,000 dentists for a population of 2.9 million, and one-third are expected to retire by 2008. As a compromise, a majority of dentists go private and accept some government-subsidized patients on the side. Stuart Geddes, the director of the British Dental Association, said that over the years the government had reduced National Health Service money for dentists, forcing them to take on heavy loads to make a living. "The N.H.S. scheme down there is under pressure because it is under-funded," Mr. Geddes said. "Dentists do go private because they don't have to work at the same frenetic pace they do at the N.H.S., and there is a better quality of care for the dentists." Dentists say that more and more people are waiting until the last possible minute to get their teeth fixed, and they are forgoing routine exams and cleaning. To make up for some of the reduced financing, the Health Service makes grants to some dental surgeries. Brynteg Dental Surgery was able to take on 300 more patients after a grant from the Health Service allowed them to hire another part-time dentist. The surgery, wishing to be fair, placed an advertisement in the local newspaper two weeks before the enrollment date with information on the extra places. Heather Davies, 25, the office manager who handed out numbers, deli style, on the morning of registration, said she was still getting nasty phone calls from some of the 300 people she had to turn away. People hurled curses and rude gestures at her. One man threatened her, saying, "I know what time you get off work," Ms. Davies recounted. She felt compelled to telephone the police. In fact, the office now has a direct hot line to the police. "Because they are paying national insurance, people feel they are entitled to service," Ms. Davies said. One poor man ? No. 301 ? simply refused to leave. He dug in, hoping for a change of heart. "I felt sorry for him," Ms. Davies said. -- Joel M. Eichen, . Philadelphia PA STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies:
2003-08-13 08:46:18
One more point: That type of dentistry is more gratifying than
spending half of one's day BSing people to accept unnecessary and underappreciated dentistry. If the market existed in the US, I would come out of retirement tomorrow and set up a clinic for that. In the US its far more complicated! Joel On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 01:52:35 GMT, "Dr. Steve" >Sadly, from what I have heard, that story is much too true. > >Please someone from the UK tell me this is an exaggeration. -- Joel M. Eichen, . Philadelphia PA STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies:
2003-08-13 13:53:47
Well a man-power problem can eventually be solved by training more people.
But, a governmental policy which does not work, is much harder to fix. I suspect the NHS in the UK will need to be eradicated and they will have to go without any such system for a couple of years, before the system can be re-created better. Otherwise, politicians just keep perpetuating the awful plan to protect their own jobs. -- ~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA DrSteve@Mancuso.d.d.s.com {remove first 3 dots for email} .................................................... This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect your health. ...................... Please ignore j..d... ~~~~``````````#####---- "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." news:teckjv4kio4pqfee2bonjsk5ftoajih4t5@4ax.com... > Hey Steve, > > When I started in dentistry, this was how it occured in the US! > > I will document it: Dr. Charles Cohen, Joseph Avenue, Rochester, New > York, the 1960s....... > > Lines so long that people waited outside! Yup. > > The dentists were not cleaning up either, rather just making a > comfortable living. > > Many dentists "were not accepting new patients" as the phrase was. > > Can you believe that! > > > Joel > > > On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 01:52:35 GMT, "Dr. Steve" > > > >Sadly, from what I have heard, that story is much too true. > > > >Please someone from the UK tell me this is an exaggeration. > > -- > Joel M. Eichen, . > Philadelphia PA > > STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies: >
2003-08-13 13:55:31
By "That type of dentistry is more gratifying",,,, are you referring to
people lined up out the door, government assisted payments, or people who are desperate to get dental care? -- ~+--~+--~+--~+--~+-- Stephen Mancuso, D.D.S. Troy, Michigan, USA DrSteve@Mancuso.d.d.s.com {remove first 3 dots for email} .................................................... This posting is intended for informational or conversational purposes only. Always seek the opinion of a licensed dental professional before acting on the advice or opinion expressed here. Only a dentist who has examined you in person can diagnose your problems and make decisions which will affect your health. ...................... Please ignore j..d... ~~~~``````````#####---- "Joel M. Eichen D.D.S." news:ekckjv85vcs31qgeqhi4f427f23vp43rdd@4ax.com... > One more point: That type of dentistry is more gratifying than > spending half of one's day BSing people to accept unnecessary and > underappreciated dentistry. > > If the market existed in the US, I would come out of retirement > tomorrow and set up a clinic for that. > > In the US its far more complicated! > > Joel > > > > > On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 01:52:35 GMT, "Dr. Steve" > > > >Sadly, from what I have heard, that story is much too true. > > > >Please someone from the UK tell me this is an exaggeration. > > -- > Joel M. Eichen, . > Philadelphia PA > > STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies: >
2003-08-13 10:06:37
Part of it in my opinion is that the UK is not in a position for its
average citizens to fork over $600-$800 for a one hour suntan light in front of your face to make your teeth whiter. In the US, 20% of the population can .... making it a business! What price do we pay for this? We destabilize currencies all around the world making the dollar stronger and their own currencies weaker. Therefore a new VCR is around $58 in Target or Wal-Mart, including profits, shipping, manugfacturing, utilities, etc ...... How it ends up is terrorism hurting all! YUP Tooth bleaching ---> increased terrorism. You heard it here first! Joel On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 13:53:47 GMT, "Dr Steve" >Well a man-power problem can eventually be solved by training more people. >But, a governmental policy which does not work, is much harder to fix. I >suspect the NHS in the UK will need to be eradicated and they will have to >go without any such system for a couple of years, before the system can be >re-created better. Otherwise, politicians just keep perpetuating the awful >plan to protect their own jobs. -- Joel M. Eichen, . Philadelphia PA STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies:
2003-08-13 10:09:12
"Needed" dental care .......
meaning a large hole in a fifteen year old kid's tooth ....... I cannoit wait to fix those! Why? I am looking to the future. I envision that after my treatment that the tooth will remain in good health as opposed to possible root canal, crown, post, extraction, bridge, implant leading to ---> extraction and dentures! In Pennsylvania of the people over 65, 32% have zero teeth so statistically this does happen! Joel On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 13:55:31 GMT, "Dr Steve" >By "That type of dentistry is more gratifying",,,, are you referring to >people lined up out the door, government assisted payments, or people who >are desperate to get dental care? -- Joel M. Eichen, . Philadelphia PA STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies:
2003-08-13 10:15:41
On Wed, 13 Aug 2003 13:55:31 GMT, "Dr Steve"
>By "That type of dentistry is more gratifying",,,, are you referring to >people lined up out the door, government assisted payments, or people who >are desperate to get dental care? REPLY: These are all the details and make no difference ...... it is the dentistry that counts. All things being equal I prefer third party payment in full, no matter what dollar amount. It eliminates lots of expense, cost of collecting it, billing for it, dunning patients, the nonsense about dentistry. Most government programs are scrupulously accurate. Insurance companies will screw you but government plans will not. After a while you realize that sending in the bill equals payment so checking up on them is a waste of time! Letting patients get their hands on checks is bad business. Many classy people take the money and ran. I threaten then, tell them I am going to small claims court, but in the end I do not (for a small amount to be gained). I just tell them to find a new dentist which was probably their intent anyway. A few tried to come back --"Oh I found the check in my glove compartment ...." I basically do not like doing business with slime-balls ........ Its tiresome. Joel -- Joel M. Eichen, . Philadelphia PA STANDARD DISCLAIMER applies:
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